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Quotes from Ab: XII October 30, 2010

Posted by Dev in Musings, Quotes from Ab.
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“You know, we have a wife-led relationship,” Ab said the other day.

“We do?” I replied.

He looked at me like I was a dummy. “Of course we do,” he said. “Think about it.”

So I thought about it.

He is right, of course. From the very beginning of our marriage—in fact, it probably started when we were dating and I took over his checkbook—I’ve been in charge. When we were first married, we rented a house that didn’t have a washer and dryer and so we had to go to the laundromat, a chore I never particularly enjoyed. He took that on without much discussion. We also only had one car. For me to get to work would have required a walk to the subway, then riding on the bus and then another walk to get to the hospital. I know, I know, thousands of people do this every day but getting up at 5 am to be at work by 8 didn’t particularly appeal to me, so Ab offered to be my chauffeur. I happily accepted.

Some might say, “You were newlyweds. Of course he was going to be super-nice in those days.” Maybe that’s true but super-nice never stopped.

Over the years, more chores and tasks have become his responsibility. We had cleaning people for quite a few years but when we documented a few incidents of theft, they had to go. At that time Ab pointed out that he could clean the house and we’d save $150/month. Fine with me.

We bought a John Deere tractor to mow the lawn (we have a big yard) and I liked driving around on it. But he complained about my grass mowing technique and so I said, “Fine. Do it yourself.” And he has, ever since.

Probably the last big chore I handed over was cooking and grocery shopping. This happened in 2006. One, I realized I was bored with cooking after 27 years and two, our daughter is a very picky eater. I was tired of her turning up her nose at everything I made and expecting me to prepare two meals, one for the family and one for her. So, I quit. This wasn’t done with any big fanfare or announcement. I just stopped. I am not sure I consciously even realized I had stopped. It just happened. After a few weeks of eating really strange meals, Ab stepped up to the plate and began to prepare dinner. Soon, he took charge of meal planning and grocery shopping. I bought him a copy of The Joy of Cooking and got a few subscriptions to cooking magazines with about-to-expire frequent flyer miles. (He is especially fond of Everyday Cooking from Martha Stewart. Just FYI.) I cook on occasion and when I do it is a treat for everyone—at least I think it is. LOL. Ab has turned into decent chef who is quite creative in searching out new recipes. Now that our daughter is off at college and he doesn’t try to cater to her food needs, he has gotten even more adventurous. It’s fun for us. (As I type this, he is steaming a lobster for some sort of exotic lobster dish. One advantage of living in New England…)

I have always handled the day-to-day money. The big things—mortgage, car loans, etc., have always been a shared decision but paying the bills? Ab doesn’t have a clue.

The one place where we have had totally shared responsibility is in raising our children. We were both completely invested in this and put in the time and energy required to be parents. And in this day and age—believe me, time required is a lot. But I don’t begrudge one minute we have spent being the very best parents we could possibly be.

My point? This is our life. This is our life for the 32 years we’ve been married plus the 11 months before when we were dating and engaged. I’ve always been in charge. But, up until a few months ago, I never heard the expression “wife led marriage,” “female led relationship,” “femdom,” or any variation thereof. It wasn’t on my radar screen.

The other thing that wasn’t on my radar screen were the accoutrements that seem to go with FLRs (or whatever) as described in various blogs. That is, we don’t have a contract (beyond the one we have specific to chastity that is described here). Ab is not being branded, pierced, beaten, whipped, forced to wear panties, diapers, or a bra; he is not handed a daily list of chores that he must complete and if he doesn’t complete them to my satisfaction, he is punished. That’s not happening in our household. I do not ask him to cook dinner naked (although sometimes he does that on his own but that has more to do with his enjoyment of being nude rather than any sort of subservient role to me). I don’t demand that he do certain things for me—massages, foot rubs, bringing me a glass of wine—but he often does. He does it because he loves me, not because we are in a FLR. And I do things for him for the very same reason.

Now chastity has entered our lives. Did I seek out chastity because I wanted more control or an additional tool for discipline? Absolutely not and regular readers of this blog will know that’s the truth. We discovered chastity as a hot game that intrigued us and one that we have come to learn we both enjoy; the unexpected benefit is that it has brought us enhanced communication and a greater understanding of our lives together. Part of that understanding, I must grudgingly admit, is that I am calling the shots and running the show, ie, a FLR, although I abhor that label and won’t be using it. I only bring it up so that other women and men who might be reading this blog and are trying to sort out what is going on between them can realize that a woman can be strong, confident, and assertive but that does not invariably lead to punishing, diapers, and cuckolding.

Trust me, I know what I am talking about. I have 32 years of experience.

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Comments»

1. david - October 31, 2010

Dev, Ab,

Lovely post. It’s very refreshing that the joy of male chastity play hasn’t been distorted or abused in your marriage. I think the “32 years” part has something to do with it. One must not confuse cause with effect, but I am guessing that your continued marriage success is a result of the wisdom and maturity shown to one another. ……….. but I just can’t WAIT until Dev decides to keep Ab chaste for longer periods. Can you imagine how much better of a loving husband Ab can become?

Many accounts say it takes at least three months of orgasm denial for the brain to really adjust….. Ab? Are you able to help us find out….for science?

David

2. Mykey - October 31, 2010

I realise I am becoming a lone voice but I have to say I really don’t like posts like these. Its nothing personal, and there are others who do the same, the chastity forum is becoming that way to my disappointment.

Firstly there is the delineation of what you are by what you are not. This I find rather a negative way to describe ones self. I understand that you are trying to show women that there is life without the extreme kink in it, but… That leads me to my second point.

My kink is OK, yours is not. This community of kink aware people is made up of many tastes, we try very hard not to judge other peoples likes and dislikes, we know that normal society would judge all of us harshly and we choose not to be part of that negativity. This post is all about saying that my FLR is OK, you can live this way if you are new to it, the other is not OK, its too extreme. Extreme only by your standards, my wife would be horrified by locking me up for 53 days but loves whipping my bum. Your lifestyle is more extreme than hers in her mind. Are we all to judge ourselves as within acceptable and others as outside? Where does that lead?

Finally as a resource for the new comer, especially women as you intend it to be, if she has any interest in any of the other kinks, secret and shameful, barely admitted to herself, then this post perpetuates societies message, its bad and dirty, hide it away. Having made a first attempt at discovering or learning about kink she has been told by a fellow kinky person no less, that some kinks are still bad.

In many ways that is worse than the fantasy poster who writes scary rubbish. They are easy to filter out after a while, but when a sane intelligent person tells me its not OK to whip, or wear panties or whatever, then the reader is much more likely to listen. It is after all reinforcing societies pernicious sex negative message, but more discerningly.

I hope you don’t take this personally, I know you are a deep thinker and will consider what I wrote. Know that I have a lot of respect for you though I may disagree strongly on some things.

M

3. likes2blocked - October 31, 2010

@Mykey –

IMHO, she acknowledges that what kink is OK is completely relative to her and Abs. Next, if a reader is coming from a standpoint of something you or I may consider quite mild being spicy, then this is reassuring, and I think that’s the target audience – someone who might be dipping their toe into chastity.

It’s also an affirmation that you can do a ‘FLR’ (for lack of a better term – I don’t like some of the connotations, either) without going way off into some of the more extreme stuff that we see out there. _You_ may know this, but the average person wanders into the “She makes the rules” web site, and it is a bit much. Is that where chastity inevitably leads? Dev’s answer is no, doesn’t have to. A more interesting theme is the self-awakening she’s documenting – she didn’t think of herself as a domme type, but she’s coming to realize that she is a bit of one. My wife’s doing the same thing.

I also think there’s a tremendous difference between saying that chastity and a bit of D&S doesn’t _have_ to involve cross-dressing and whips and saying that those things are bad. People are quite welcome to go as far down that path as they like, but the key point is that they don’t have to. It isn’t that slippery a slope.

4. Mykey - October 31, 2010

Hi likes

You make some very good points, and fundamentally I agree with what you say and what dev is trying to achieve. In fact very much so. I agree that the more extreme blogs and stories can be very off-putting. I suspect most of the worst ones are fantasy but not all. My own blog for example, which started pretty vanilla, has become as our life has progressed quite extreme.

Where I disagree is the tone of this and similar articles. There is a negative tone about ‘other’ that I perceive. It may be just me but I think someone who is already uncomfortable with their own kinkiness could have their discomfort increased by reading this. It’s not as neutral as you say, at least in my opinion.

So we agree on the intent, but not on the subtext.

M

5. Mykey - October 31, 2010

Thinking about it I am surprised by the connotations some of you guys have with flr. I came across it first with blogs based on the around her finger concept. So for me it’s association is very much about what the woman wants and a strong supportive sub. Though there is kink it’s not very extreme and it’s within the boundaries of what the wife enjoys.

devotedlvr - October 31, 2010

Hi Mykey,

As always, thanks for your comments.

I just re-read my post and I guess I don’t see the negativity that you are reacting to. I also don’t see where I say some other kink is bad–what I am saying is that there are certain things that are not for us.

As far as I can tell, there are two blogs being written by women where chastity is the focus: mine and Sarah Jameson’s. However, there are plenty of blogs written by women whose husbands are wearing chastity devices but the device is part of a larger “program of behavior” (for want of a better term). I assume they are having fun and good for them, but as L2BL noted, for a newcomer searching for information on chastity, some of the activities being put forth in some of these blogs could be a little off-putting. I think this could be especially true for a woman whose husband has suggested chastity and she doesn’t know much about it. He says, “Honey, I’d like to try this, I think it could be hot and a good thing for our marriage.” She then googles chastity and comes across a blog that says, “We’re in a FLR and I keep my sissy-husband’s worthless little cock locked up while I go out and fuck good looking studly men.” Can’t you see how that might be a little distressing to someone who knows nothing about chastity? It was for that reason that I started this blog–to complement Sarah’s since she was, at that time, the only female blogging who had a viewpoint similar to mine.

You wrote: the chastity forum is becoming that way to my disappointment. I am not sure what that means. It’s too vanilla? Something else? I find the posts and threads interesting but then, it fits in with the way my husband and I are living our chaste lives.

Though there is kink it’s not very extreme and it’s within the boundaries of what the wife enjoys. I guess we’re not reading the same blogs. I’ve read one where the woman is musing about branding her husband and asking for opinions on the design of the brand. Yes, branding, with a red-hot branding iron. I’d call that pretty extreme. If that’s what they want to do, have at it and have fun but for me, that’s quite a way out of my comfort zone.

D

6. There’s a New Blog on the Block « The Key is on my Nipple Ring - October 31, 2010

[…] comment from Belle that got me thinking about my own relationship with Ab and partly what prompted my post yesterday. Belle wrote: I am still struggling with “What if someone finds out?”, and more than […]

7. mykey - October 31, 2010

I dont mean to suggest that the post is overtly negative about other kinks. Its a subtle thing, a general feeling. For example you say..

‘Ab is not being branded, pierced, beaten, whipped, forced to wear panties, diapers, or a bra; he is not handed a daily list of chores that he must complete and if he doesn’t complete them to my satisfaction, he is punished.’

The implication is firstly that most FLR contains these things. I would not agree. I have read many with semi-vanilla wives who have learned to enjoy being in charge, without being sexually over the top.

Secondly the implication though its not clearly stated is that these are bad things, hence you would not want them in your life. Its not an accepting statement but a reactionary one. By lumping all the extreme things together its again demarcating them as extreme and exaggerating them by association with each other. Sure if I did all these things together, and if they were forced, that would be a huge deal, but most people do some of them, at some times, and often fairly lightheartedly. You have a piercing, its not a statement of your submission. I have one but its not because the dominant partner forced her weak sub to do it. Wearing panties can be a game, lighthearted, not a path to sissification. But the association implies that its a serious thing that leads inevitably to a weak sissified husband. Even humiliation can be done for a laugh, not as a way to truly demean the recipient. So is punishment bad? Not really, its how you do it and why that makes it extreme. Its common to suggest it in the sex tips section of many common women’s magazines such as Cosmo. Yet the reader sees it in the ‘bad’ category. I think in most dominant relationships (and I have met quite a few lifestyle female dominants in the scene) you will find a certain lighthearted touch even in the more extreme areas which makes it much more palatable. In short the timbre of the post shows these kinks up as inappropriate and a path to weakness or badness.

I would suggest that many of the blogs you are reacting to are fantasy though I am sure not all. Yes if true the branding is extreme, but much more so than a tattoo? I mostly have come across ones with a fairly vanilla women exploring a bit of kink and a lot of enjoying getting her way domestically and emotionally. In a sense it doesn’t matter. You have set out to provide a resource that will not scare women who want chastity but not much more. I applaud that, I dislike the effect that the fantasist has on the rest of us and in my own blog try to balance the fun stuff with enough real life to show that this is fun, but it can be within a strong healthy context. Like you I hope someone real will find help or useful information in it. I totally agree with your aim, but to lump the ‘other’ kinks together in an area labelled ‘scary’ is simply a variant of my kink is ok but yours isn’t.

‘I must grudgingly admit, is that I am calling the shots and running the show, ie, a FLR, although I abhor that label and won’t be using it.’

Why grudgingly admit you are calling the shots? Because in your own mind that is associated with the extreme stuff? Do you see how the associations are also forming for the reader. And similarly why abhor the label? Read ‘Around her finger’, one of the first books I found to introduce FLR to vanilla women, and you will find a much more positive association. Not that I think the book is great but its not a bad start.

Finally if we were to view your blog from the POV of a vanilla women, you used to be a naturist. You have your nipples pierced, and keep a chastity belt key hanging off one. Your husbands first stint in it was over 53 days… That’s extreme. They may not react better to that than a bit of introductory ‘punishment’, meaning a light spanking.

I am giving examples of what to me comes across as an us and them tone. I will never be comfortable with seeing my community of kinksters develop internal walls like the ones society has already put up. I appreciate that the message needs a bit of information to show that one does not have to lead to the other, and that to do that you need to say what it is it does not have to lead to. That’s not the problem. Its the way the other is portrayed that makes it uncomfortable to me.

Finally I suspect that many of the women reading, even the vanilla ones, will quietly have at least one or two of those fantasies themselves. Please dont risk making them feel more uncomfortable than they already are.

—-

As to the chastity forums. Its the same slightly negative tone I see in a few posts there. A bit preoccupied with how great and sane we are, as measured against them.

devotedlvr - October 31, 2010

Mykey, I think we’re just going to have to agree to disagree and that’s okay. You have your view and I respect that. Thanks for taking the time to comment, too. I do appreciate your thoughts.

Just a few quick things:

Secondly the implication though its not clearly stated is that these are bad things, hence you would not want them in your life.

I never said, nor did I intend to imply that these are bad things. I just said they are not for us. That’s a big difference to me.

Why grudgingly admit you are calling the shots?

I was grudgingly admitting that I am in a FLR and the grudging part comes from my not caring for the term–and I don’t care for it because of the blogs I have read–which are not the same blogs you read. So no need to belabor that point anymore.

Finally if we were to view your blog from the POV of a vanilla women, you used to be a naturist. You have your nipples pierced, and keep a chastity belt key hanging off one. Your husbands first stint in it was over 53 days… That’s extreme.

::shrugs:: I suppose. If you met me, you’d probably think I’m pretty ordinary. And I suppose that’s the point. LOL. We’re all pretty ordinary, aren’t we, no matter what we do in our private lives. I guess on that point we can agree.

D

8. mykey - October 31, 2010

I guess we do, though I agree with more of what you write than not. I do want you to know that I appreciate what you are trying to do with this blog, and that regardless of the areas in which I disagree I think it is a big positive for the community to have it here. I would not even have had this conversation if I didn’t think highly of you and your writing.

M

devotedlvr - October 31, 2010

Thank you, Mykey. It is nice to know that out there in the chaos of the interwebz it is possible for people to have thoughtful, sane, honest discussions. Your comments have certainly given me a great deal to think about this morning and I am sure I will continue mulling these issues for days to come. Thanks again,

D

9. Tom Allen - October 31, 2010

Mykey, just try to keep some things in perspective. When you hunt around on teh interwebz for information on chastity or OD, you find a lot of sites, forums, and blogs that show chastity in a BDSM or FLR context. You find very little about it in a more vanilla context, and even less written by women.

I can attest that there are a lot of people – men and women – who have gone online, and who have been put off (if not downright horrified) by what they’ve stumbled across.

Do some members of the new Chastity Forum poke fun at the sissified sissycuck crowd? Well, yes, they do, because those behaviors are squicky to them. It doesn’t mean that they don’t think anyone shouldn’t enjoy them, and maybe some people could express a little more tolerance in their views, but I find it hard to fault a small number of people who have finally found a small niche group in which they can feel comfortable. I suspect that most of what you perceive as negativity will dissipate once the more vanilla/less extreme (however you want to label it) crowd becomes a bit more settled.

devotedlvr - October 31, 2010

Thanks, Tom. As always, I appreciate your comments. Thanks for taking the time to post.

Hugs,

D

10. mykey - October 31, 2010

Hey Tom

True the balance is heavily skewed to the more scary stuff, certinly if you include the porn sites and some of the forums. I agree and thats partly why I value Devs blog. Its also why I bother to comment, because these saner voices are the most valuable, the most likely to be listened to.

Its ironic that I feel like promoting more tolerance. I have often been one to rail against the same extremity. For example I am annoyed by what has happened to Altairboy’s website, which was for a long the THE place for chastity. It has been taken over by extreme stories. Regarding Thumper’s forums I understand why, but I do hope the tolerance does come back. As you say it may settle down. These are forums I value which is why I want them to be better. Better is of course subjective, but I hope you know what I mean.

M

11. j - October 31, 2010

Why exactly does anyone care about what Dev and her husband explore? Let them find their own way. I personally would enjoy reading about their journey without passing any judgment. Wherever it leads, I can say that Dev is one of the most intelligent,thoughtful, and decent bloggers to occupy this odd genre.

There. I’ve put you all in your place. Wherever that is. Grins of course!

devotedlvr - November 1, 2010

Well thank you, J! You have certainly made my day! Big hugs to you,

D

12. femsup - October 31, 2010

I am over joyed to have read the very reasoned and restrained (pardon the pun) discourse.To me sites like the Female Led forum that came out of the Venus On Top idea are not full of hard line kink.They are very much about what you and your partner are into without you even knowing it.


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